6 weeks to get contracted for Navy Diver. What are my options

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
So as the title states I have 6 weeks to get selected for a Navy Diver contract.

I have been going to the gym 6 days a week and yesterday was my first PST with the SpecWar Mentor and other potential candidates. Some contracted some non contracted. My mentor told me as some of you already have as well 6 weeks is not a lot of time to get contracted let alone be fully prepared for the rigors of dive prep and dive school.

To my understanding SPECWAR contracted candidates now have their own division in boot camp and do more pt but not much more.

My current contracted rate is MMS (machinist mate submarine) however I do not want to be a MMS but that was the placeholder rate they gave me at MEPS even after asking me if I wanted to try for diver so they could get me more time to train. Even after telling my recruiter I wanted AD (Aviation Machinist Mate) 6 weeks is simply not enough time to train in my eyes and as I said before my mentor agreed and told me to ask for a roll out in my ship date to which the Chief said NO.

I told him if I could not pass my PST in 6 weeks I would simply not ship out because I’m not going in with a rate I’m not going to enjoy. His response was “Okay” and hung up the phone.

15 minutes later he calls me and explains that my first impression is not going well. I inform him that I understand I’m coming off blunt but this is MY future and I will do what I see fit to ensure I have the most success and satisfaction possible within my future in the Navy and if they can’t work with me on rolling my ship date out to give me more time to train why bother?

He puts his boss on the phone who informs me that I need to show how motivated and dedicated I am. Go to the PSTs and clinics with my mentor and show progress on every PST I do. And maybe just maybe they’ll be able to roll my date out. They have a lot of kids coming in saying they want specwar and then show up to 1 or 2 PSTs and ask for a roll out and in the past everyone who requested a rollout for specwar got it then they never ended up shipping so that’s why I need to prove myself.

Both my oboarding recruiter the Chief who told me no to a ship date roll out and my initial recruiter who sent me to MEPS informed me that “you know it’s easier to contract for diver once you’re already in the Navy right? Oh submariners get extra pay too. And the foods better If you just listen to them at the PSTs chances are it won’t take you 6 weeks to contract.” “We can do a Delayed Action Request for AD if you want but we want to give you pool time first and there are no guarantees an AD spot will open up”

Okay fine. So I show up to the first PST and work with my mentor on technique for the CSS and do roughly 500-700m of swimming some mask flooding which I’m comfortable with after having open water dive certs at 12 yrs old ive come it before. Finned dolphin treads hands above the head. I did 48 push-ups and 39 sit ups 5 pull ups and unfortunately a large sign of not having pushed myself hard enough on my own time I puked on lap 3 of 13 on the run and got a DNF (did not finish) because I couldn’t run and puke at the same time.

Granted I get up at 0400 everyday hit the gym at 0500-0700 and go to my full time job at 0800. My new training routine after my first PST experience will consist of swimming minimum 500m to practice my CSS technique and condition my body. I’ll get out of the pool change clothes as fast as possible. Do as many push-ups in 2 minutes, as many sit ups in 2 minutes and then crank out as many pull ups as I can to failure then do the difference between that number and 20 as negatives. Then do my 1.5 mile run. In the hopes that I’ll get my body used to this faster and be able to at least finish everything out without any DNFs and further more in hopes of passing with satisfactory PST Scores to contract in the next 6 weeks.

what are my options in this situation and what are your thoughts on my training regiment.

Do I have enough time if I’m putting in the work on my own time 6 days a week?

If I’m showing steady progress on PSTs what are the chances they will actually honor the-ship date roll out request?

I feel like I got royally fucked on this one and I’m not sure what else to do besides drive forward and hope to God I pass my PST and that it’s enough to get me through my pipeline.

I’m trying not to have doubts and stay strong mentally but I also realize I can’t avoid reality if it’s simply not enough time in training to successfully pass my ND pipeline.

Any and all advice is greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ooh-Rah

Marine
Moderator
Joined
Sep 12, 2012
Messages
11,704
1: In the spirit of helping this dude out, please reference this intro thread. Hello my name is Zac I’m 22 and in the DEP for Navy

2: Dude! Paragraphs so your friend, I am going to add a few to your op so that readers can have a half assed opportunity to help you and understand what you’re trying to say.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
Thank you. I thought I had given spaces between things to better help with that but when I posted it just all smushed together.
 

Ooh-Rah

Marine
Moderator
Joined
Sep 12, 2012
Messages
11,704
Not directly related to you specific issue, just letting you know you’re not the first person wanting to bail on a start date and hav to fight for what you believe is right.

Here is my recruiter/MEPS story -

I was a complete fuckup in high school and had to repeat my senior year. When I told my recruiter that I wanted to put off shipping to boot camp for one year so I could graduate with a diploma, he put me on a bus to MEPS the next day to "discuss ".

Once there, they were complete and total dicks. At the time I had burned my parents enough that they did not bother going with me, It was the first time in my short life I had to stand for principle. There was no internet then, (yes there was a time) so I had no one with experience to ask for advise, I just knew what I was supposed to do.

I remember a corporal coming into the room where I was sitting (think of the interrogation rooms you see on TV cop show) and really giving me hard time, telling me that I was disgracing the Corps before I even joined it. Then a Major came in, he was the good cop. The Major explained how the Corps needed me "now", and that my delay would cause people to question my patriotism and love of country.

He put a phone in front of me, told me to call my mom and let her know I'd be shipping directly to San Diego that night! ( No idea what they would have done with me, probably put me into some type of "shit platoon" until I could start a new series.) He went on to tell not to worry about my diploma, I could study for my GED during my "off time" at bootcamp. Jesus, I think about that now...bootcamp was hassle enough, cannot imagine trying to study for my GED at the same time!

I did end up calling my mom, but to tell her what they told me and that I did not want to go until I finished high school the right way. After that I don't remember much, this was in 88' so Gulf War had not kicked up yet - maybe quotas were tougher to reach then.

In the end I held strong and shipped one year later - no worse for the wear, but with a high school diploma, the respect of my family, and most important the first "defining moment" of my life. It is one I think back to often.

Stay strong, assuming you qualify, you'll get what you want. It's all a game, and you have the advantage of knowing the rules better than most.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
So do I continue to harp on my onboarding recruiter about a ship date roll out? He’s been a total dick to me so far. Even my specwar mentor said he heard that the Chief was treating me like shit. Or do I request a Delayed Action Request for a different Rate than MMS and do my time in that rate train for a couple years and then request through my command for a dive contract? I don’t like the idea of backing out entirely because the military is the next step in life but I can play hard ball if I need too to get them to work for me. I just don’t want to push too hard and have them fuck me more than they already have and potentially not work with me at all on anything.
 

Devildoc

Verified Military
Joined
Nov 3, 2015
Messages
5,355
Location
Durham, NC
May I be blunt? Your numbers suck. I am not going to say you 'can't' be ready in six weeks, but I will say your likelihood of success is very small.

If I were you, I would entertain two options: 1) get out of it entirely, get your mind and body right, then go back, 2) ship now into a non-dive job, kick ass, get right, and try later.

If you stay MMS, it is a very tough, dirty, and nasty job, but Dolphins are very well-respected in the Navy. In context, there are fewer sub-qual'd sailors than SEALs on active duty. You can get go to dive school (open circuit, basic) as a submariner which would open doors.
 

BloodStripe

Marine
SOF Support
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
Messages
4,144
Location
CONUS
SSMP
Military Mentor
My recommendation, if you don't want to be a MMS don't sign a contract for one. Recruiters give ZERO shits about you once you graduate boot, and it is in their own best interest to get bodies there. You want a diver contract? Back out. Get in shape. Go back once you can easily pass a ND PST. There are plenty of internet resources out there to guide you on how to get there. If your recruiters tell you that you'll have a hard time getting another contract they are full of horse manure. Don't burn the bridge but at the same time keep your own self interests first until you become part of the team, and then you will be able to decipher when to put yourself first and when not to.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
I’m thinking my best option is to either ship as MMS or request a DAR for a different rate and train for a couple years then go for a dive contract. I understand my numbers suck. I thought they would give me a lot more time to train than they did. I only signed for MMS because the Chief Liaison at MEPS said that’s the job I needed to take if I wanted to try out for Diver. I’m a mechanic now as it is but I don’t want to be a mechanic for the rest of my life and that seems to be the only jobs available to MMS per Navy COOL outside of the navy. Even if I did contract I’m sure I still wouldn’t be fully prepared for the pipeline and As much as I wouldn’t quit I’m sure they would find a reason of their own to drop me and then I’m going to the needs of the Navy.
 

Devildoc

Verified Military
Joined
Nov 3, 2015
Messages
5,355
Location
Durham, NC
I’m thinking my best option is to either ship as MMS or request a DAR for a different rate and train for a couple years then go for a dive contract. I understand my numbers suck. I thought they would give me a lot more time to train than they did. I only signed for MMS because the Chief Liaison at MEPS said that’s the job I needed to take if I wanted to try out for Diver. I’m a mechanic now as it is but I don’t want to be a mechanic for the rest of my life and that seems to be the only jobs available to MMS per Navy COOL outside of the navy. Even if I did contract I’m sure I still wouldn’t be fully prepared for the pipeline and As much as I wouldn’t quit I’m sure they would find a reason of their own to drop me and then I’m going to the needs of the Navy.

So I have been out of the Navy for a minute, but that doesn't pass the smell test. We have a saying in the Navy: "Choose your rate, choose your fate." Ain't no shame in MMS but it is not an easy job. DAR or go back. If you are remotely hesitating about MMS, DO. NOT. DO. IT. It's YOUR career.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
At MEPS they told me they had zero Aviation Maintenance jobs so I’m sure they will try and tell me if I submit a DAR I’m not going to get that rate. Are there any ways to ensure/guarantee they give me that rate?
 

BloodStripe

Marine
SOF Support
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
Messages
4,144
Location
CONUS
SSMP
Military Mentor
At MEPS they told me they had zero Aviation Maintenance jobs so I’m sure they will try and tell me if I submit a DAR I’m not going to get that rate. Are there any ways to ensure/guarantee they give me that rate?

I'm confused. No where have you ever mentioned aviation maintenance. What do you want to do if you fail ND training? Pick that MOS. If it means waiting till one opens up, then wait. I waited almost a year to ship because I wanted to be a Marine grunt. I depped in December of 2001 and shipped in October. 9/11 meant a lot of dudes grabbed 0300 contracts. If you hate your job in the military, you will hate being in the military.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
I'm confused. No where have you ever mentioned aviation maintenance. What do you want to do if you fail ND training? Pick that MOS. If it means waiting till one opens up, then wait. I waited almost a year to ship because I wanted to be a Marine grunt. I depped in December of 2001 and shipped in October. 9/11 meant a lot of dudes grabbed 0300 contracts. If you hate your job in the military, you will hate being in the military.
I may not have in the forum, that’s my fault. Aviation Maintenance was the job I told my recruiter I wanted. It was my #2 pick on my top 5 list with Diver being #1. When I got to MEPS they had no aviation jobs at all. And the Liaison said asked me if I wanted to try out for Diver and I said yes. He informed me that if I wanted to try out for Diver that MMS was the rate I need to pick with that ship date I have in order to have the option to go diver. I don’t fully understand why I couldn’t pick any rate and still try for diver in the DEP. But I went with it and figured I’d give it my all to get a dive contract in the next 6 weeks.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
Update: The mentors for SpecWar are needing me to take off time from my full time job and my employer is unwilling to work with me on that time needed. So unless I can get the mentor to give me the PT plan for those days I need to either miss work completely or leave early then I’m really fucked even more so than before.
I can’t back out of the navy because I’m already struggling financially as it is. I’m not a high schooler living under mommy and daddies money. I pay all my own bills and even if my employer did work with me on time off I’d be short on money to pay all my bills in a timely manner. Seems like the military is geared towards only naive highschools who have no problem getting out of school early or for a whole day and don’t need to work a full time job to support themselves. At this point I’m going to meet with my onboarding recruiter ASAP and submit a DAR for AD and hope some highschool kid doesn’t ship or pops hot on a UA, something and I can take that slot. I’ll train my ass of for 2 years in while in the navy and after 2 years in my rate whether it be AD or even MMS I’ll request to go Diver and take it from there.
 

Ooh-Rah

Marine
Moderator
Joined
Sep 12, 2012
Messages
11,704
Seems like the military is geared towards only naive highschools who have no problem getting out of school early or for a whole day and don’t need to work a full time job to support themselves.
You are going to want to re-think that statement. Understandably you are frustrated and angry right now, but you have no idea the number of men and women you have inadvertently disparaged.
 

J.

Verified Military
Joined
Oct 18, 2015
Messages
192
Location
Some Beach
Update: The mentors for SpecWar are needing me to take off time from my full time job and my employer is unwilling to work with me on that time needed. So unless I can get the mentor to give me the PT plan for those days I need to either miss work completely or leave early then I’m really fucked even more so than before.
I can’t back out of the navy because I’m already struggling financially as it is. I’m not a high schooler living under mommy and daddies money. I pay all my own bills and even if my employer did work with me on time off I’d be short on money to pay all my bills in a timely manner. Seems like the military is geared towards only naive highschools who have no problem getting out of school early or for a whole day and don’t need to work a full time job to support themselves. At this point I’m going to meet with my onboarding recruiter ASAP and submit a DAR for AD and hope some highschool kid doesn’t ship or pops hot on a UA, something and I can take that slot. I’ll train my ass of for 2 years in while in the navy and after 2 years in my rate whether it be AD or even MMS I’ll request to go Diver and take it from there.

Okay, there’s a lot of good advice being offered here for you and what you do with it is up to you. I’m going to back out of this thread after I address this.

You are not special, what makes you believe you are any less naive about the military than a high schooler? A lot of what you just said above tells me that you are.

On this board alone, there are individuals who left careers, family’s, “mommy and daddy’s house”, poverty, and riches all to join the organization. Your circumstance is irrelevant.

Your best chance at becoming a Navy Diver is to join as a Navy Diver, only when you are prepared for it. You assume that joining in a different rate is fine because you’ll train hard for 2 years and then take a crack at it. What makes you think you’ll have the time, energy, permission, to do such things?

If you join for a job, that is your job, your service is that job and in the first two years you will be expected to only focus on that job. Even the most menial jobs take time and effort to learn and be good at. If you want your command to support your dream, you have to support the mission.

You do what you want, but maybe sit down and think about how you’re coming across to members of this board. As it stands, in my worthless opinion, I wouldn’t want you on my team.
 

ZBarbour97

Unverified
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
13
I apologize for coming off with the attitude that I have. I sincerely meant no disrespect to any one at all. If I have disrespected you with my above comments again I am sorry. I will take the advice given to me and leave this thread as is.
 

Arf

SWCC
Verified SOF
Joined
Sep 16, 2019
Messages
410
Location
United States
SSMP
SOF Mentor
Mods please give me a chance to post on this thread before it gets locked. Or at least let me post after it is locked.

I am the most relevant person to give advice to this young man for three reasons:


1. I joined within the last three years, and I know exactly the process he is going through.

2. I’m not only Navy, but I have gone through the special programs physical screening test and process that he needs to pass now that he is in DEP.

3. I have insight into his pipeline.


I wanted to post this now just to come back to it, because unfortunately I may not have time to go in depth.

My quick response:

You won’t make it in 6 weeks. Even if you miraculously do, you will get hurt either in DEP, in boot camp, or in the pipeline. The minimal standards are a recruiting tool. If you make it on minimal standards you will not make it through the pipeline.


I promise to come back here with what exactly I think you should do, unfortunately I just don’t have the time at the moment.
 
Top