Armenia and Azerbaijan

Blizzard

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Potentially, Article 5 of the NATO Charter bad, between Russia and Turkey
Hypothetically, I wonder if Russia would really throw down with Armenia. It's interesting because while CSTO exists between them, Russia maintains relations with both countries and has much larger arms sales with Azerbaijan. Seems they have a vested interest in both.

Can those of you more familiar with the region help me understand Azerbaijan's interest in retaining the Nagorno-Karabakh region? Then lines drawn are not that old. If it's mostly Armenian and self autonomous, why fight for it? It's a largely mountainous region, are there resources/minerals they want to retain? I understand the argument to succeed or remain completely autonomous from the Armenian perspective. The Azerbaijan interest to retain it is less clear to me.

And fuck Turkey. He's like the asshole friend of your buddy that always tags along and starts shit every time you just want a nice relaxing night out. Time to vote them off the island.
 
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Gordus

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According to the title and description, this is - not graphic - footage of Azeri special operations forces after conducting a successful ambush "behind enemy lines", against an Armenian supply convoy.

 

Gordus

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The U.S. have allegedly deployed a Global Hawk into Georgian airspace to observe the situation in Karabakh.

 

DA SWO

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Disagree all you want, a conflagration that involves Turkey and Russia is probably "as bad as it could get," and that's what was asked for.
Article 5 is the mutual defense article.
Turkey and Russia killing each other in Syria or elsewhere does not get Art 5 treatment.
FWIW we (the US) were the first NATO country to get Art 5 support (after 9/11).
 

Phoenix15

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I understand why this community wouldn't be inclined to give a straight answer but why isn't the US actively pushing to remove Turkey from NATO?

From a naïve US civilian perspective, we don't need bases on Russia's southern flank like we used to and we can service our ME operations from other bases in the gulf. We don't seem to need Turkey all that much and I remember reading about some disputes over operations at Incirlik.

If I was European I would care a lot more about Turkey as they control the bottle neck of migration. However Im not and I DGAF about their migration problems. Where is the Turkish benefit to the US that I'm not seeing?
 

Gordus

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The fighting continues as any prospect of a ceasefire seems hopeless.

Meanwhile very messed up things are happening

This does seem to be evolving into a Karabakh War 2.0 and I fear war crimes will assume greater dimension.

I just hope it won't go as far as ethnic cleansings.
 
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Cookie_

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I understand why this community wouldn't be inclined to give a straight answer but why isn't the US actively pushing to remove Turkey from NATO?

From a naïve US civilian perspective, we don't need bases on Russia's southern flank like we used to and we can service our ME operations from other bases in the gulf. We don't seem to need Turkey all that much and I remember reading about some disputes over operations at Incirlik.

If I was European I would care a lot more about Turkey as they control the bottle neck of migration. However Im not and I DGAF about their migration problems. Where is the Turkish benefit to the US that I'm not seeing?


Short answer, to the best of my knowledge:

Historically friendly to Israel, somewhat "stabilizing" presence in the ME/Caucasus area, still strategically important area that we don't want Russian (or Chinese) to have possible controlling interest over.

Someone like @Marauder06 or @AWP can probably give a more in depth response.
 

AWP

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I understand why this community wouldn't be inclined to give a straight answer but why isn't the US actively pushing to remove Turkey from NATO?

From a naïve US civilian perspective, we don't need bases on Russia's southern flank like we used to and we can service our ME operations from other bases in the gulf. We don't seem to need Turkey all that much and I remember reading about some disputes over operations at Incirlik.

If I was European I would care a lot more about Turkey as they control the bottle neck of migration. However Im not and I DGAF about their migration problems. Where is the Turkish benefit to the US that I'm not seeing?
The Bosporus, history/ nukes, an outpost on the southern flank of Russia, offset a growing Russian influence, some...facilities we possess in that country, off the top of my head.

I think Turkey falling under the Russian sphere of influence is a foregone conclusion, the timeline is the wildcard. Once we wrap up in Iraq Incirlik becomes less important to current operations. Hell, I'd make the case to leave Incirlik and spin up bases in the PI to support the "pivot to the Pacific."

In 5-10 years, Turkey won't be a NATO member. Shoot, if Trump wins in Nov. that 5 years could be optimistic.
 
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