Officer shoots man before he can hurt....himself.

Ooh-Rah

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#1
This one really has me puzzled. The man was threatening to harm himself...no one else. Why shoot him?

As details emerge about Minneapolis City Hall shooting, officers' actions lauded, questioned

In the eyes of some, the Minneapolis police officers who shot and critically wounded a suicidal man after he refused to drop his knife during a tense standoff in an interview room showed tremendous restraint in the face of grave danger and acted appropriately — heroically even.

But to others, the cases raises some complicated questions about whether the officers acted properly when they drew their guns and fired on a man who appeared to only be a threat to himself.

The man who they shot, 18-year-old Marcus Fischer, lay in a hospital bed Wednesday recovering from wounds both self-inflicted and after being struck by several police bullets. Later that day, prosecutors charged him in connection with a shooting that led to his arrest.
 

Andoni

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#3
It sounds to me like shooting this guy was driven by adrenaline and commotion, compounded by the crazy who wouldn't stop stabbing himself in the chest and didn't respond to be tazed. The article said that Homicide was actively negotiating with the man while he was stabbing himself. That made me more sympathetic.

In my experience, "negotiating" with a violently self-injurious individual, covered in blood is one of the shittiest scenerios I can think of. Personally, it's right up there with anything that involves human feces, aka Pakistan. I have a difficult time imagining that this guy was only a threat to himself, mainly because I don't trust people who stab themselves unless it's a very good reason.

I may be missing something though.
 

Ranger Psych

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#4
Did anyone actually read the article? This guy was unhinged and LTL failed on him, in the confines of an interview room.


"After his arrest at the Mall of America in Bloomington on Monday afternoon, Fischer was brought to police headquarters for questioning. At some point during the interview, the detective handling the case, Sgt. Kelly O’Rourke, got up and left the room, according to multiple department sources. When he returned, Fischer was stabbing himself in the neck and chest with a knife.

Several investigators, including O’Rourke and Lt. Rick Zimmerman, who heads the homicide unit, huddled outside the room briefly to come up with a plan. In the meantime, they summoned two patrol squads to headquarters for help in subduing Fischer, according to multiple department sources. One of the arriving officers, David Martinson, was carrying a Taser. He fired it, but it failed to stop Fischer. Fischer ignored repeated commands to drop the weapon and get down on his knees and appeared to advance toward the officers at one point, according to several people who have seen a recording of the encounter. Zimmerman was negotiating with Fischer, when several of the officers fired their guns, apparently in response to the young man’s actions, according to multiple sources."



"Later on Wednesday, prosecutors filed charges against Fischer in connection with a robbery in northeast Minneapolis. Fischer was charged with first-degree assault, first-degree robbery and possession of a handgun by a prohibited person, but because he remains bedridden, no court date has been set.

According to authorities, Fischer arranged to buy a Kel-Tec 9mm handgun from a 21-year-old Elk River man, who agreed to meet him on the afternoon of Dec. 13. But, after the man and a friend let Fischer hold the gun, he pulled out his own firearm and said that the Kel-Tec was now his, prosecutors said.

As he left, he shot the Elk River man once in the chest, according to a criminal complaint filed in Hennepin County District court Wednesday. The man’s condition is not known, but police said that he remains hospitalized.

The victim’s friends later concocted a story about how the man had been shot during a road rage incident in Ham Lake."
 

Andoni

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#5
Thank you. You said in one sentence what I spent two paragraphs trying to say.
 

policemedic

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#6
One of the arriving officers, David Martinson, was carrying a Taser. He fired it, but it failed to stop Fischer. Fischer ignored repeated commands to drop the weapon and get down on his knees and appeared to advance toward the officers at one point, according to several people who have seen a recording of the encounter.
This is why he was shot. There is an infinitesimal line between suicidal and homicidal. He may have advanced on the officers to achieve suicide by cop, but that doesn't make the decision to fire unreasonable.
 

Ooh-Rah

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#7
If by some tragedy you have not seen this movie, the below clip should be considered NSFW due to language.

 
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Devildoc

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#9
I think like a lot of things that have been posted in the past few years involving a LEO shooting, we are seeing part of the picture and the media's versions are not the full story.
 

AWP

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#10
HTF did the dude carry/ find/ whatever a knife in an interview room? Is not searching a suspect in that scenario a standard thing?
 

Agoge

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#11
HTF did the dude carry/ find/ whatever a knife in an interview room? Is not searching a suspect in that scenario a standard thing?
Unfortunately, there has been a rash of these happening a lot more than it should lately. Things like this happen a lot more than what is shown in the media.

I think the worst part of it is complacency and thinking "what could go wrong here." It's a sad scenario because often times, LEO's get injured as well.

Complacency kills!
 

256

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#12
I’ve learned that combating complacency in LE is very difficult. You can tell a dude to not park in front of houses when you’re going to a domestic violence a hundred times, but they still do it. They cite prior incidences of complacency to back their decisions to be complacent; it’s really crazy. I’ve done this for 10 years, nothing bad has happened, rgr, I’ll park down the street a little.

I believe it happens because the chances of something really bad happening are small. Some Police Officers have never been in a bad situation. I’m lucky in the fact that I’ve felt like I was in bad bad situations, not so much in Police work, but I can fall back on that moment of being scared. Being scared is not a bad thing. Most Policemen have a hard time with two words, compassion and scared (in my experience).
 
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