Top SEAL gives deadline

DasBoot said:
So to shed light on “Fight club”- the “Charters” are not enforced like you would be led to believe. Since 9/11, most guys stay in Batt. Often in the same Batt, sometimes the same company, and occasionally the same PLT. When “charter time” came back about the time I showed up, it was a burden and a blessing.

If a guy wants to make E8 in Batt, he has to do something outside of Batt. RASP/RASPII/SURT cadre all count. RI fine counts- though most dudes Regiment wants to keep stay in house as either A)RSTC (prior mentioned courses) or B) gets a Cush job near their old Batt as a BLC instructor. The bad ones who need real time away or are not wanted back go be RI’s at Ranger school or go to the Big Army (not including the E9 level).

This all goes back to what @Box brought up- guys keep their MOS in Regiment. A tabbed infantryman is still an 11BV4. A commo dude is still a 25 series with the V4 identifier. It makes it easier for Regiment and the Army to keep tactically competent dudes around or send them somewhere else to be a stud, even if they are shitbags.

SEALs having a rating that essentially keeps them out of Big Navy prevents them from going there and being used as an asset. For instance- a Regiment medic who gets RFS’d can go to the 82nd and know what is up, honestly with SOCM be a better asset than most PAs, and continue serving. Albeit unhappily. But they can go take a job in the Army. SEAL medics can’t say the same.
Click to expand...

I will say it’s not hard to get re-rated in the Navy or lose your rating. It’s just not common practice anymore. Though I’ve seen a Corpsman become undesignated Seamen, which I promise you. Is not a job anybody would want.
It’s just quite uncommon.
 
DocCallahan said:
I will say it’s not hard to get re-rated in the Navy or lose your rating. It’s just not common practice anymore. Though I’ve seen a Corpsman become undesignated Seamen, which I promise you. Is not a job anybody would want.
It’s just quite uncommon.
Click to expand...

Cross rating definitely happens, but could you imagine a SEAL "medic" being forced to cross rate as a HM, and the assignment he would get if he was a shit-head with a bad rep? Sure, a solid warrior with good skills who happened to be collateral damage would end up probably in a pretty good billet, but the others? Not so much.

The other SOs would be SOL and be turned over to the needs of the navy, truly be victim of (paraphrasing) "get your rate, get your fate".
 
The downfall of special Operations is eventually going to be the phrase, "but he's a helluva good guy"
...the next worst line is, "He's the kind of guy you want in a gunfight"

I know he is facing charges for choking someone to death as part of a sexual assault "prank", "but he's a helluva good guy"
I know that guy helped embezzle 90,000 dollars in operational funds, "but he's a helluva good guy"
I know that guy got busted smuggling cocaine into the US by trying to hide it in a punching bag, "but he's a helluva good guy"
I know he got caught in a quarter of a million dollar fuel scandal, "but he's a helluva good guy"

"He's the kind of guy you want in a gunfight" - but getting him to stop stabbing prisoners in the neck is a little tricky
"He's the kind of guy you want in a gunfight" just stay clear when he starts burning and burying the dead bodies or you'll go down with him
"He's the kind of guy you want in a gunfight" you just need to keep a short leash on him so he doesn't start shooting unarmed civilians


It isn't just the SEALs - its EVERYONE that thinks SOF is some sort of passport to no holds barred fun and excitement.
 
Last edited:
@Box, those are opposite, inextricably so: one cannot be a shit-head, and be a good guy, and that is the very perception we (royal we) need to combat.
 
Here's the thing with SEALS, if you get rid of the SO rating, they are now competing with very dissimilar people. You can't compare a SEAL to a Ranger because Rangers do Infantry shit. A SEAL does not do pipefitting or damage control. So do you expert them to maintain proficiency in both fields? If people steering ships suck at that, how do you expect them to be able to do that plus maintain all their other equals? I'd rather see them maintain SO skills over all that other crap.
 
BloodStripe said:
Here's the thing with SEALS, if you get rid of the SO rating, they are now competing with very dissimilar people. You can't compare a SEAL to a Ranger because Rangers do Infantry shit. A SEAL does not do pipefitting or damage control. So do you expert them to maintain proficiency in both fields? If people steering ships suck at that, how do you expect them to be able to do that plus maintain all their other equals? I'd rather see them maintain SO skills over all that other crap.
Click to expand...

Well, UDT and SEALs only did it that way for 50 years, so it can be done. But, it's certainly not optimal, which is why they created the SO rating. The main issue was at promotion time since they were testing on source rating material (i.e., damage control, etc.) and competing against peers in original source rating.
 
A lot of SEAL candidates are drawn to the outlaw cowboy culture. 19 year old me thought becoming that “Rogue Warrior” was the ultimate achievement. A lot of guys advertise the Teams as if you aren’t even in the military, but you get to do the cool stuff that the military gets to do. So we all kinda went in thinking we were special from the get go.
 
Devildoc said:
Well, UDT and SEALs only did it that way for 50 years, so it can be done. But, it's certainly not optimal, which is why they created the SO rating. The main issue was at promotion time since they were testing on source rating material (i.e., damage control, etc.) and competing against peers in original source rating.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Why test them on something for proficiency they don't use? We dump millions on training them to do other jobs. I get why it would be easier to have another rate, but it just isn't practical.
 
It's too easy to make them revert back to a previous rate and or assign them a new rate.

18X have to be 11B before SOPC. Prior service hold a different MOS prior to SFAS. Why not with other branches such as Navy SEALs?

But whatever, silly argument as it doesn't in anyway address the problems in NSW. Personally I think the boot from JSOC/SOCOM for a few years with basic boat deployment as a maritime SOF capable unit would probably do them some good at righting their people and rep at this point. Anything else is pretty much a bandaid to very problematic culture in NSW.

Put them on anti-piracy for awhile, let the shitheads move along, let them learn to be quite and humble, then reintroduce them.

As it sounds they ain't getting much play right now anyway...
 

Eric Deming - Retired Navy SEAL "It used to be just a few bad apples, but they've been able to rot a lot of the apple cart." Later on saying "I got two boys that are old enough, and I wouldn't even let them be apart of it."
 
1566591706611.jpeg

For SEALs, it’s back to regulation haircuts and uniform inspections

Released to senior leaders and then obtained by Navy Times, Green’s guidance returns the SEAL and boat teams to standards expected of service members across the fleet, with a mandate for leaders to conduct “routine inspections of your units and strictly enforce all Navy grooming and uniform standards, including adherence to all Navy traditions, customs and ceremonies.”

Commanders will inspect their officers and sailors during uniform shifts, establish “weekly battle rhythm events” to include quarters, unit physical training and zone inspections, with Green personally holding leaders “accountable for all substandard issues related to your personnel on and off duty.”

“We are U.S. Naval Officers and Sailors first and foremost and we will realign ourselves to these standards immediately,” the WARCOM boss wrote.
 
Devildoc said:
Bwahahaha! You mean they have to be held to a standard like a real unit and real sailors?? No more SEAL team 6 combat beards? No more woodland cammies on bottom, desert on top strolling around the base?
Click to expand...
Big boy rules, act stupid and you get garrison life. The SEALs aren't the only ones who need a taste of garrison life; they are just the worst kid in the house for now.

Going 100% BDU's after 9/11 was a stupid move by management.
 
Another thing that bothers me about all of this has been the public's reaction to it. Just read social media comments about the Gallagher case. People are defending his behavior shouting down anyone who criticize it as "snowflakes" or anti- American. The infatuation with SOF has just gone too far. They are no longer quiet professionals. What happened to holding these men to a higher standard? I believe this whole mindset is a cancer that the Navy needs to radiate quickly.
 
Ooh-Rah said:
View attachment 29107

For SEALs, it’s back to regulation haircuts and uniform inspections

Released to senior leaders and then obtained by Navy Times, Green’s guidance returns the SEAL and boat teams to standards expected of service members across the fleet, with a mandate for leaders to conduct “routine inspections of your units and strictly enforce all Navy grooming and uniform standards, including adherence to all Navy traditions, customs and ceremonies.”

Commanders will inspect their officers and sailors during uniform shifts, establish “weekly battle rhythm events” to include quarters, unit physical training and zone inspections, with Green personally holding leaders “accountable for all substandard issues related to your personnel on and off duty.”

“We are U.S. Naval Officers and Sailors first and foremost and we will realign ourselves to these standards immediately,” the WARCOM boss wrote.
Click to expand...
Admiral Green is not fucking around....

First on CNN: Navy SEAL leaders fired after allegations of sexual assault and drinking among team

"Commander, Navy Special Warfare Command Read Adm. Collin Green relieved the three senior leaders of SEAL Team Seven from their positions Sept. 6.," US Navy Capt. Tamara Lawrence, a spokesperson for Naval Special Warfare Command, told CNN in a statement explaining the rare move.

Green relieved the unit's commanding officer, Cdr. Edward Mason; executive officer, Lt. Cdr. Luke Im; and the team's top enlisted leader, Command Master Chief Hugh Spangler due to a loss of confidence that resulted from leadership failures that caused a breakdown of good order and discipline within two subordinate units while deployed to combat zones," Lawrence added.
 
policemedic said:
I’m not sure Navy personnel decisions that are the result of discipline or perceived poor performance need to the subject of public press releases.
Click to expand...
I would usually agree, but in this case I believe that the Navy is doing a very public retooling of the SEAL’s.

My guess is that these announcements are also being made to show not just the other services, but possibly other nations, that something more than just lip service is actually being done about the SEAL’s and their ass-hattery.
 

Similar threads

D
AFOSI (Air Force Office of Special Investigations)
Replies
0
Views
2K
Deleted member 10816
D
K
Source verification
Replies
7
Views
3K
Kaiba
K
Marauder06
Full Spectrum Ops in the Homeland- a "Vision for the Future?"
Replies
2
Views
2K
Red-Dot
Red-Dot
Ravage
Faster combat power, less exposure in the assault zone
Replies
1
Views
3K
AWP
AWP
Back
Top